“I’m not making stuff for regular people,” states Nicolas Pesce. “It’s more about people who know what they like. The trailer is a great representation. If they see a glimmer of something that checks off one of their boxes, hopefully, they will come to see it. But, the beauty of Indie movies is that you don’t have to test audiences. You get to film your wildest dreams. If it works, great, but if it doesn’t, you fail by your own hand.”

Nicolas Pesce grew up outside of New York City, where he had an appreciation for movies at an early age. When it became time for school, he chose NYU for their film program. This led to directing a few music videos and eventually meeting the gang over at Borderline Films. Together, they helped him create The Eyes of My Mother.

“I was working with Josh Mond on his movie James White (Christopher Abbott). The editor couldn’t start for a couple of months and they were looking for someone to go through the footage and help with the movie. I got established with those guys and eventually, they asked if I had a movie I wanted to make.”

Nicolas Pesce

Pitching Affordable Movies

By pitching a movie “as cheap as humanly possible,” Pesce knew he could make a short for little to no money that showcased his style. “I filmed the scene from the movie where the guy she’s been keeping in her barn tries to escape. I reshot it for the movie, but we shot that original scene for zero dollars. So I said, this is what I can do for nothing. If you give me a little money, I can make the movie.”

“I had been directing music videos so the short form was what I was doing at the time. So I made this short and the producers liked it. I became friends with one of the investors and we were off. I went into the movie thinking the movie was so weird, artsy, and esoteric that no one was going to watch it. But there’s something beautiful in that mindset that lets you feel freedom. When it got into Sundance and people actually liked it, I was shocked,” he added.

For this particular short, style was a major factor. “It depends who you are as a filmmaker and what your focus is, I knew that for me the kind of intriguing thing was what would normally be a lowbrow idea – a violent movie nearing torture porn – but you make it like it’s really, really high brow. The story, or lack thereof, isn’t necessarily the drawing point. It’s the style and the tone that makes it unique.”

“That’s what I chose to lean into. The short didn’t reveal much story, but it revealed the mood of the piece. But, if you’re doing something that’s all about the story, I think you want to showcase that. Showcase the selling point of the piece.” For his next film, he found a book he wanted to adapt and then looked back to influences from Italian horror for cinematic inspiration.

Adapting Piercing’s Tone

Based on the novel by Japanese author Ryû Murakami, Piercing follows a man who kisses his wife and newborn baby goodbye. Then, he goes through with his plan to kill a stranger in a hotel. The new film stars Christopher Abbott (It Comes At Night) and Mia Wasikowska (Stoker).

“I had started reading Piercing when I was making The Eyes of My Mother. I really loved the book. It’s very much like a Japanese author poking fun at the Western Psychosexual Thriller—movies like Basic Instinct. It uses a lot of classic thriller tropes, but flips them on their head and uses expectations against the audience.”

“It’s a fun book and it felt like a great way to make a movie about the dark subject. The Eyes of My Mother is so bleak and intense, so I wanted to show another side of myself that was a lot more playful—still dark, but playful. The producers of Eyes helped me get the rights to the book. While I was doing the festival tour, I was writing the adaptation and then we made it about a year after. It was nice to pay homage to new movies and touch on that unique Japanese weird sense of humor.”

The tone begins with a relatively dark premise. “It takes a couple of minutes for you to realize the tone. There’s a moment when the baby speaks and I knew if the audience laughed at that, we had them. It was always a goal for the audience to know what the movie was in the first five minutes so they weren’t lost. It’s tricky because you don’t want to undermine the movie or make it feel silly. A lot of came from trial and error through the performances and the music. Every part of this movie is a delicate tonal balance, but that’s part of the fun.”

Pesce joked, “A lot of making movies to me is just like a kid who stole his parents’ car. It’s just a matter of time before you get caught, but I’m going to try and get as far as I can while I can still get away with it.”

Mia Wasikowska

Planning Ahead

Essentially making two films back-to-back comes from Pesce’s ability to absorb material and plan ahead. “I’m perpetually thinking about what’s next. I’m someone who doesn’t like to sit idle. I don’t like not working. Also, when making Eyes, I knew if anyone liked it, I wanted to be ready to make something else.”

While making Piercing, the director also did something unique in terms of staging. Because of his meticulous planning, he decided that he wanted to makeshift a storyboard, even though he didn’t have the budget in prep. He used stand-ins for the first film, but with Piercing, he used miniatures on a hand-crafted mock set.

“I built miniatures of the set in doll form and literally shot the whole movie in miniature. Cut it together with dialogue and music. Tried to make as much of the movie as possible to see what scenes might work and better ways to do something. Also, every crew member watched that version to get in my head and see how I saw the movie before we ever made it.”

Choosing Freedom

A film like Piercing really depends on how the main actors portray the roles. The cat-and-mouse chemistry is crucial, but it’s still an eccentric film by any means. “If you’re fortunate enough to have investors who give you creative freedom, you should get away with as much as you can possibly get away with. You don’t get to do that forever.”

“I feel lucky that I got two movies made where I got to [be creative]. There are plenty of filmmakers who never get to do that. If you find yourself in a position where you have freedom, go crazy. You’re not always going to get to do that and you want to show people what you have in you. People don’t know what you’re capable of until they see it, so you have to take advantage of the opportunities and be bold.”

“The beauty of indie movies is that no one is audacious enough to think they’re going to become rich off of being an Indie financier, so a lot of the people who do it are in it for the love of the movies and a patron of the arts. Indie movies are your place to do what only you can. People like it and you’re right or people hate it and you’re wrong, but there’s a beauty in that freedom.”

This article has been condensed. Listen to the full audio interview HERE.